City of IF

[Key]

The next chapter of the featured storygame "The Machine's Daughter" has been posted:

Chapter 14: Words and Battle

Discussion and voting are complete for chapter 14.

For more about the storygame, see the New Players Start Here topic in this forum.

[Chinaren]

Carry on to the witches says I. Or try to anyway, though survival may come first.

[Muaddib]

Nice, I sort of expected that ot happen anyways. I say we go on to Prometheus, I mean the watchmaker. Somehow I don't like the idea of going to either the serpent witches or back to the Zigots.

[Shady Stoat]

Poor Pilla. This quest for self-knowledge is certainly taking its toll :shock:

The way I see it, if she goes back to the Zigots, she'll lose the only friend she has. Salva will either be forced to turn back because they won't allow her into the city, or she'll be 'pet-ified', like Peran was. I think she's changed too much that the zigots are virtually strangers to her now.

She could decide to go for these eagles, but she has no more idea where they are than where the serpent-witches are. Plus she'd be changing goals again. A lot of scarpi have just died so that she could go and see the serpent-witches. In a way, she owes it to them to try to see it through.

How she'll find them, I have no clue, though. Perhaps a short expedition to the Zigot city might be in order, after all. They're bound to have reference books and libraries that she could study in. It's tempting to go back to research at this point. And it has the advantage that it's logic, and Pilla would want to take refuge in logic at the moment.

[Rachel]

I really think she should see the eagles, then go on to the serpent witches. Going back to Zigots would mean she were to give up on everything she's already done. It would mean the death of her friends had come to nothing. I think the eagles because as the scarpi (can't remember her name) said they are not far. It might not match with logic but it's a mystery she's dying to know.

[Kalanna Rai]

You must carry on to the serpent witches. Every time you try to temporize you seem to lose something else precious to you...

[Smee]

Great Chapter, :D

Tiny little typo :

Quote: Was there was nothing you could have done differently?

I'm with Stoat and Kalanna - there's no point changing goals right now. Continue on to the serpent-witches.

The only sticking point, didn't Rigiva send out troops to fetch the witches back? So not only are they likely to be on their way back to the Virivoi but under escort. :?

Under that situation it may be possible to play on the marriage still, assuming they wouldn't know of their Kings death. But it would be tense, and it means we're also looking for a moving target.

I like the idea of Pilla going to the Zigot's, alone, for a swift visit to perhaps learn something. I'd like an extended visit, as I'm sure they'd be fairly friendly to someone who removed Rigiva - but I don't want her to lose Salva's friendship.

I'll see what others come up with, but for now I sit on the serpent witches side of the fence.

Happy Writing :D

[Muaddib]

A thought: Since the plans were quite open to the Vitrovi that Pilla intended to go to the Serpent Witches, wouldn't they assume that she was still headed there, and chase her there? Just a thought.

[Mother Goose]

I don't think the Virivoi are going to be fetching the witches back under escort. These are not little grass snakes, but powerful dragon-like creatures, who have their own agenda and are not necessarily friendly to any of the Twelve Races. They probably couldn't even find them, if the witches didn't want to be found.

I like the idea of a short visit to the Zigots, but her killing of Rigiva might not be welcomed there either, if he is the one who has been letting the supply caravans through. But it might help to go off the straight path to the Wild Lands; as Muaddib says, her destination is known to her pursuers.

[Alegria]

Go to the Witches, says I, there may be a lot of problems, but she's already had so much blood shed for her to do so.

[Araex]

Witches.

The eagles are nothing but a curiousity, and don't really make sense at that. They are also violent and dangerous.

The Zigots probably won't welcome Salva with open arms, and might even reject Pilla, if her tale has spread.

[LordoftheNight]

I'd say to head for the Serpant-Witches, but keep a look out for the Eagles as you go, especially seeing how they're supposed to be on the way.

[D-Lotus]

Seeing as the Scarpi are after her, maybe she should take refuge with the Zigoz. She could pretend Salva is her "pet".

But are the scarpi really after her? They have no leader now, and the new leader might not want to chase her.

On the other hand, if she manages to refuge herself in the mountain, its not likely the scarpi will get her, since their bodies are made for the desert, not the mountains, and they will get tired (especially without Rigiva).

I don't know...

[Stubby]

OK, this is going to ramble a bit...

I don't think that we need worry too much about the guards that were allegedly sent out to find the witches. If they were ever sent, which I have some doubts over, then they certainly don't yet know that she's killed Rigiva - for all they know, she is now their Queen.

As for guards following, well, it looks to me that the place is a military run 'kingdom' and there is no direct heir, which means that all of the senior commanders are now going to be wondering who is going to be the next king, which means that not many of them will want to commit large forces to chasing off after some weird animal who is nothing but trouble anyway. It would only weaken their personal positions at home.


Heading for the Zigots is unlikely to do her much good - they probably won't want a Scarpi in their city if they are occupying a spot on a holy mountain - she could be a spy or a prelude to an attack. So that could lead to her losing her one remaining friend and companion.


The Eagles just sound like a dangerous option to me. Can you imagine walking up to a giant bird and asking "Excuse me, but I believe that you and your ancestors have been tormenting my god for several milennia, and I'd quite like a word with him. Could you tell me where I might find him, please?" She doesn't even know if they would know anything about the watchmaker's current whereabouts. So, if she meets them while she is looking for the serpent witches, all well and good and she should maybe try to subbtly see if she can find any answers to her questions, but she shouldn't let herself get distracted on such a vague hunch that is probably only being brought on by her self-doubt over her current path since that path has just caused so much death.

I say go for the serpent witches, still. They still seem like her best source for information, and they may well know a lot more about the watchmaker and the liver legend, including whether or not the local eagleas are also guardians that would prevent anyone else from getting close to their prisoner.

[ethereal_fauna]

Pilla needs to stay focused on one goal, which has been pointed out. She needs to follow through with finding the Serpent-Witches. However, her marriage acceptance was a ploy to gain a little power to accomplish her goals. As the dying king said, she bested him and now all he had is hers. She needs to surround herself with council- who does Salva trust; who would Nogola have trusted?

Taking her rightful place as queen, especially an unmarried queen who gained her title through deceit, will not be an easy task. But running and hiding won’t be easy either. She could surround herself with trustworthy Scarpi if possible. Let them manage the political aspects of which she has no concept or understanding. Then use her power and position to find out what she wants to know.

She and Salva will accomplish little as fugitives, will accomplish little if they seek refuge with the Zigots. Although they’re close to the mountains, a desperate retreat across the desert to gain council with Scarpi that Salva trusts will offer so much more. Pilla can claim the wealth and position of Rigiva, for as many that view her as a traitor, an equal and strong amount surely see her as a hero if not a god.

A temporary delay in seeking her knowledge and asking her questions will secure her a greater chance of success in not only finding out what she set off to, but simply surviving in this war that she’s unwittingly became a key player in.

[Kalanna Rai]

Stubby made a good point about the Eagles, there's no garuntee that they'll be of any kind of help...

I still say you need the Wtiches. With their backing won't it be easier to secure your title as Queen? Even if they don't openly back Pilla she might be able to lean as though they did...

[Ravenwing]

I think Shady, Rai, and Smee make a good point in that its not a good time to change courses. We risked all this to go to the serpent-witches.

Yet whatever decision we make, it is safe to assume that we will have Rigiva's people after us either way. And fauna, here makes a good point, that Pilla has become queen though through deceit. Running away is not the way of a leader. We must still have friends among the Scarpi that Salva would know of. Maybe it will be a good idea for Pilla to delay her search about herself. She has a whole people to lead. And I think that is the way she should go. Gather the broken tribes of the Scarpi.

There is more than one way to knowledge. :cool:

[Ravagerrr]

Ok, new to the forum, but I have to take part in this story... it rocks so far! I have recently read the story from beginning to now, and the one thing that I feel our Heroine has failed to do is really research her situation. It is interesting that such a learned race such as the Zigots would have so little understanding of the other races and their cultures, although they do carry a good deal of xenophobic and arrogant tendancies. True, they may respond to the Scarpi poorly, especially due to the war that they were/are having. The problem here is we're not exactly sure what the war is ABOUT. Nor do we know what the previous daughter of Taremto did, or really how she got killed. It is unfortunate that Pilla never really managed to get the truth out of Rigiva before she killed him. Additionally, why were her followers so certain that Rigiva had betrayed her in the first place? According to the storyline so far, Masakita was killed defending Mount Olympus and no explenation of HOW Rigiva betrayed her has been given. I guess it's a bit of a moot point now. Although I believe that Pilla desperately needs to know what she can possibly learn through study in Nugoz, and through observations there, she is in danger of causing a stir among the Zigots with her presence there. The Zigots are very aware of her and may detain her as well as her companion. Additionally, she needs to approach the Zigots as an ambassador of the Scarpi, a woman of both worlds, and she has not yet established herself as a Queen yet. One must wonder exactly why Masakita was willing to fight the Zigots for the mountain, and what makes it holy. Is it the very mountain that the Watchmaker suffered upon, possibly still suffers on? Is the Watchmaker the same entity as Taremto himself? Could it be that he has, with limited remaining power, sent this daughter of his to free him? Many possible things could be afoot here, and I think the only way to answer these questions is to find the Serpent Witches. However, the Serpent Witches sound like the "fates" to me, as there are many allusions to Greek mythology here, or perhaps even the Medusa :x , which would be even worse. They could well be a dire threat to Pilla. Masakita's death is still shrouded in mystery, and it is possible that Nogola is wrong and that the witches are at fault for the death of Masakita. Obviously, Masakita turned to them in counsel yet met an untimely fate, are they to be trusted? Do they stand against the true underlying goal here? If the eagles can be approached, albeit they may well be very dangerous as well, then perhaps they would have a better insight as to the nature of the Serpent Witches. It would be foolish to charge on into the midsts of the Serpent Witches without knowing more about them than what little the legends tell. But then, its also possible that the Eagles could provide no assistance in determining the nature of the Witches. I would say then to approach the lair of the Witches, but be wary and seek any clues as to their nature before an encounter.
Perhaps the golden armor could give a strong protection against the possible dark nature of the witches, but where did that end up?
It is also true that any pursuers after Pilla would seek to find her in the wildlands. Therefore, it may be the wisest and most clever alternative to circle back around to the warcamp in an attempt to determine how things ended up. She could remain hidden while Salva goes in, disguised as a Virivoi, to determine the outcome of the battle. There IS an off chance that her side was victorious, as the Virivoi may have been divided, the chaos giving each individual a choice whether to believe her or not, and many may have left the battlefield feeling no reason to fight for a dead King. They will likely be scattered, and Pilla's return may give even disheartened Virivoi a cause to fight for. I like the idea of the return, but doing so before recieving affirmation of her heritage from the Serpent Witches could backfire desperately, but the chaos will eventually subside, and the Virivoi will likely fall into a civil war of sorts which the Imperials will take advantage of. If she waits to return, she might not have much of a kingdom left, and the warriors may all be slaves of the imperials. She NEEDS to make sure that doesn't happen. Therefore, this is an excellent story decision point. All paths seem torn equally.

My suggestion: She doubles back around to analyze(one of her most habitiual behaviors) what has become of the Virivoi and of her followers, who she would be a fool to abandon. She needs to do so with great care not to be taken captive and she needs to have a plan in place if that does end up being the case. Her goals in doing this would be to recover her armor and weaponry for the contingency that the Serpent Witches are not so friendly as all have assumed, to gather support from disenfranchised Scarpi, to free her followers if any remain, and to gauge what will likely happen politically among the Scarpi now that Rigiva is dead. She should first consult Salva on these matters first. Salva's wisdom may be crucial in determining a logical strategy.

[D-Lotus]

ethereal_fauna wrote: A temporary delay in seeking her knowledge and asking her questions will secure her a greater chance of success in not only finding out what she set off to, but simply surviving in this war that she’s unwittingly became a key player in.

True, but how do we know that she will succeed in conquering the Vivori? Haven't we underestimated them already?...Didn't we all think the soldiers were going to be happy when we killed their leader? Didn't we all think Pilla was going to take control of the Vivori kingdom?

Plus, at the moment, she is inside Vivori territory...how does she plan to get back without being found...now she only has one follower and her wits won't help her to convince the Vivori to join her.

I think she should go ahead into the Wild Mountains because it will refuge her from her scarpi persecutors. Not only this, but she will continue on her search. Our purpose is not to unify the scarpi- a tribe which Pilla in reality has no connection to, except through the mention of an obscure semi-god called Masakati which looked like Pilla. Our purpose is to understand what we are and why. We don't necessarily have to see the Witches or the Eagles, but we have to keep searching for this meaning. True, we could find this meaning from reuniting the scarpi, but why would Pilla do this, if she doesn't know why she's doing it?

I feel that by going into the mountains, we might find something....not necessarily the Witches or Eagles...but something that will lead us further into our quest.

Ravagerrr- Read "The White Queen" in the Archives for the history of the scarpi.

[Key]

Hi Ravagerrr, thanks for the great comments, and welcome to the City! :D

Poll is up, everyone. Happy voting.

:-)

[ethereal_fauna]

D-Lotus wrote: Our purpose is not to unify the scarpi- a tribe which Pilla in reality has no connection to, except through the mention of an obscure semi-god called Masakati which looked like Pilla. Our purpose is to understand what we are and why. We don't necessarily have to see the Witches or the Eagles, but we have to keep searching for this meaning. True, we could find this meaning from reuniting the scarpi, but why would Pilla do this, if she doesn't know why she's doing it?

She knows why she's doing it...

I suggested that the Scarpi reunite the Scarpi. That Pilla surround herself with those that she trusts (which is only Salva at this point) and those that Salva trusts.

Pilla can then use her position of power to seek her answers. She won't be running from anyone, won't be quietly asking questions or afraid. She'll be queen, surrounded and protected, and in a position to freely search for answers (for the most part).

And that is the why of what she'd be doing.

[kingcappie]

If the Scarpi are unified then learning more will be easier. Pilla didn't seek out Gorgos or head to the Goatfoot Forest. She's dealing with the Scarpi, is surrounded by the Scarpi, has inserted herself (however unwittingly) into Scarpi affairs. Ignoring it won't make it go away. She'll be forced to confront it in the end. Might as well get it done with, and have support for her goals, than to plod on as a fugitive with only one ally.

[LordoftheNight]

Voted, and winning.

[Smee]

I've been convinced... she's just done something very dramatic with her confrontation with Rigiva, and needs to see it through to her advantage.

Running is just going to waste time and minimise her chance to think and sort things out in her head as to her goal.

Calling on her logic and philosophy education she can pull together what she knows of the scarpi traditions to unite them all.

Happy Writing :)

[ethereal_fauna]

Smee wrote: I've been convinced... she's just done something very dramatic with her confrontation with Rigiva, and needs to see it through to her advantage.

Running is just going to waste time and minimise her chance to think and sort things out in her head as to her goal.

Calling on her logic and philosophy education she can pull together what she knows of the scarpi traditions to unite them all.

Happy Writing :)

Certainly! :D It's not like she'll be called on to rule or govern...all of that can be delegated. She is with Salva now, and she knows the trust and loyalty that some of the Scarpi are capable of. The serpent-witches are still an unknown.

I believe that it is in her character to finally realize that her logic hasn't helped her in many cases, and that she needs to learn how to play by the animal's rules if she is going to survive. She just killed someone- it's got to mean more than a headlong flight into the unknown followed by those who want her dead.

[Ravagerrr]

Ok, a bit embarassed to find that there have been other storylines regarding this world, but I think I've caught up for the most part. I voted against my own idea so that there would be strength in numbers. The attempt to unify the Scarpi seems the best route to me, although I now have a better understanding of who the serpent witches are, they could still represent a big problem for her. It's still a good point that she could really have trouble uniting the scarpi without the blessings of the witches, but from what I have read so far, it seems the witches might be on the whole opposite side of the fence from what Pilla's true goals may end up being.

[D-Lotus]

Well, I voted to unite the scarpis...because the serpent witches are not exactly what I was aiming at. I sort of wanted to wander into the mountains aimlesly, looking for fate to smile on her...but ok.

I still see problems like:
a) We're deep in Vivori territory...how do we get back?
b) Why do we think Pilla has the strength to unite them?...She hasn't demostrated much except that she's a weakling and uses treachery (like killing Rigiva when he didn't expect it). If the scarpi see it the same way, its not likely the more obstinate ones will prevail by us.
c) When the scarpi tribe queen let Pilla go, it was because she was going to see the serpent witches or something. But she didn't...which means she can't go back to that queen or the other tribes.

[Chinaren]

I am with D all the way here.

Plus, why is she getting involved anyway? :? Get back on course and go and see the guy that fixes Rolexes, or whatever he is called. He is the main man, and hopfully can cast some light onto why she isn't a 'proper' metal person.

[Ravagerrr]

Right, being deep in the scarpi territory would be a problem with returning to the tribes to unite the scarpi. I mean, my original proposition was a matter of attempting to unite the Scarpi in general, but she should start by revisiting the camp because its the closest destination, she needs to know what happened there in the wake of her dissapearance, and it is the best place to start to begin to reunite the Scarpi. Sure it's dangerous to be there with murderous Virivoi scouring the place and all but it's also where she may have the greatest hope of planting the seed of unifying the desert people. She does not yet know who the victor of the battle really was, I mean, her people could have won, despite having been outnumbered, the Virivoi may have fallen into chaos themselves, there is no telling how many fought for her and how many fought against her. With her killing their king, some, possibly many of them may have turned to defend her as soon as attack her. Chop of the head and the body thinks independantly. So sure, she should go and try to reunite the Scarpi, but she should START where she just fled from.

[Chinaren]

But WHY should she go and do that? What's it got to do with her?

Her original aim was 'self discovery' not to become queen of the Scorpion people. Leave them to their own devices says I. Move on.

[ethereal_fauna]

In order to realize her original aim, she's going to have to take care of this situation she's in the midst of.


Of course just running worked for Forrest...

[Ravenwing]

chinaren wrote: But WHY should she go and do that? What's it got to do with her?

Her original aim was 'self discovery' not to become queen of the Scorpion people. Leave them to their own devices says I. Move on.

But she is slowly discovering herself as a leader I think. Besides if we leave the Scarpi to themselves, the big gap between them will still be there. By killing Rigiva, Pilla has designated unwittingly designated herself as the leader. Someone else mentioned that earlier, I think.

Join the Scarpi together, they have been apart for too long. Besides Rigiva is dead, and he was the cause of most of the tension anyways.

[Ravagerrr]

This situation with the Scarpi goes deeper than just her own self discovery. Pilla must have some loyalty remaining to the Zigots as she was born and raised by them. She also has some strong friendship with certain Scarpi. Although many of those Scarpi are now dead, this still binds her emotionally to them. She must therefore have some desire to bring peace to the two groups, the Scarpi and the Zigots and she is in a very unique position to be able to accomplish this. I think she would be missing out on a golden opportunity to unite these two people together in a common goal. She can represent the Scarpi among the Zigots and she can represent the Zigots among the Scarpi. In the previous story (correct me if I'm wrong) the Zigots have their reasons for being on Mount Olympus, and the Scarpi have their reasons for wanting it to remain untouched. Obviously Mount Olympus has some great religious significance, and so does her very existance. If she immerses herself as a leader in the political scene between these two nations, she can more easily get to the bottom of the true issue, exposing the puppeteers behind the scenes, and possibly their motives, while being surrounded by protection, rather than having to do this problem solving in a covert manner. Additionally, its just purely a matter of goodwill towards both of these people, the Scarpi and the Zigots. United they may stand against whatever enemy is working behind the scenes, not the least of which the Minotaurs, but likely much deeper than that. And of course, divided they will both fall. I don't believe that the Zigots and the Scarpi would align themselves on opposite sides of a fence if they had greater awareness of the divine goings on underlying this whole plot, and I also think that they can gain more awareness by foiling the enemy that seeks them to remain so divided. Unfortunately, I have a suspicion that our previous heroine in the White Queen fell prey to the manipulations of the true enemy, and it is up to Pilla to make sure this does not happen to her. Additionally, it is easy to see how the Scarpi are being taken advantage of by ruthless dictators who are exploiting the disorganized and shattered nature of the tribes. Pilla could easily note this and if she doesn't want to do anything to help them overcome their divisiveness than she would have only herself in her interests and her understanding of the true meaning of friendship would have been totally lost on her, which I could admit would be possible given her ultra logical upbringing. I hope this gives a decent explenation as to WHY she might seek to unite the Scarpi.

[D-Lotus]

Somehow I don't think the Zigoz will help...they're too proud. And how will the scarpi interpret that their God-leader is friends with the Zigoz (although they probably know this to a degree).

Well, the connection could come in well in the future, anyway.

For now, the votes will decide. Then the process will be left up to Key of exactly HOW to do it. In fact, it might be our next decision point. :D

[Key]

Poll has closed. The decision, by a vote, was to go back and try to unify the Scarpi.

Thanks for the debate, everyone. We'll see how things go...

o-)

[Ravenwing]

Rava, I don't think the stories are that well connected. :P Although I shouldn't make such a observation since I haven't had the opportunity to read the White Queen yet. And I am not the one writing the whole story out. :cool:

But D-Lotus here makes a good point about the Zigots. To the Scarpi, Pilla is a God. Only her most faithful Scarpi, the ones who all died in the battle, knew she was of Zigot origin. If she were to reveal herself as being of another race, they're not going to like her deception.

Sure it would be nice to unite Scarpi and Zigots as one nation. But first she needs to fix the inner turmoil of one race before trying to bring together two totally different races. :P

[Ravagerrr]

I would agree that this whole thing must be handled very carefully, considering the valid points you've made.

[Ravenwing]

I do wonder though. Are we heading in the right direction? I mean, Pilla has basically put the idea of going to the Serpent-Witches on the back burner to instead bring together a race she is not even related to.

I mean yes, she is learning about herself and all, but I am still curious as to how the Watchmaker and his tale fits into all of this.

[Chinaren]

Exacly Ravey*! My thoughts precisely.


*But not Ravay.

[Key]

Locking this chapter. Chapter 15 up.