City of IF

[D-Lotus]

Plot, character, theme, and setting suggestions welcome! Any ideas which I can incorporate into the story, post them here. Thank you for your assistance. o-)

[Bookwizard]

Hmmm lets see here... It might be good to add in a mentor, the fisher that Robbie met in the church may be good. Someone to guid robbie and be something tangibal in this new strange world that could help him. Mybe teach him a few new things about his imagination, and help make clear to him what he needs to do, and how to do it.

Also it may be a good idea to incorporate jack back into the story at one point or other. He could join the team, with Robbie and the girl, and could share his knowledge of the area to help them.

I hope that my ideas are of same help, I hope ;)

[D-Lotus]

Actually, yes, you reminded me of a plot idea I had previously abandoned but which now seems more appropriate, considering how the story has developed. Thanks! :D

[Bookwizard]

Very welcome, but I should be the one saying thanks, so far this is the best story game that I have seen, thought I do admit I haven't participated in many, thought its still great :D

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[D-Lotus]

Interesting. I'll take it into consideration. I think this might tie in with the idea bookwizard reminded me of. Excellent.

By the way, I made Robbie ambiguous in character because I want the reader to decide what the boy should develop into- hero, coward, or villain.

This thread is fruitful so far! o-)

[Aponi]

I think maybe more personal struggle - I'm not sure how much personal struggle a kid might go through, but I think that he should feel tempted to use his power in a not-so-good way.

In order to move the plot forward, you might need to get him out of the cuffs, free his imagination, and let him just wreak havoc for awhile. Pretty soon, he'll discover that he's destroyed what's left of a very delicate balance and inadvertently nearly finished Bill's work for him.

There should be very good reasons behind WHY Bill is doing this to the country - not just the need to dominate, but why Bill feels he has to. Every villain is the hero of his own story. What "favor" does Bill think he's doing for everybody? Freeing them from their wars? Saving everyone from the threat of ripping apart the world by competing imaginations? Preventing a dangerous prophecy from coming true?

Whatever Robbie does, it needs to be the wrong thing. It should be deadly dangerous in some way that he has rescued Noemie, named Jack and Thomas, created a flying donkey, etc. Later, it might turn out to be a really good thing that he did all this, but right now, I think he should see some scary consequences. Naming people should change them somehow. Creating things with no place for them to live should make them die or become predatory in order to make a place for themselves. Power should corrupt and endanger the people who wield it.

Also, what about Robbie's dead brother? He's been absent from the story too long. Where is he supposed to fit in?

I hope this helps. :-)

[Bookwizard]

I half agree with Aponi, I believe that the reader should be held in suspense for a while longer, but just a while, in this time Robbie will get his cuffs off and settle down. Then a few mistakes wouldn't be to bad, that would increase the suspense even more, but then he needs to find a teacher. Someone who can explain to him everything that is going on, and how, and give him a set quest. That is the main thing right there, he needs a strong and interesting, possible even very unexpected purpose.

[D-Lotus]

Interesting. Robbie needs a quest, a sense of direction. I'll work that in with my idea. This new chapter will be excellent, if only I can find the time to write it.

As for Bill's story, I have already hinted at it in the museum, with that piece of writing about Nature v.s Industrialization.

Robbie's brother, I admit, didn't form part of my plans as a main character. He's more of a transition and his absence becomes proof of Robbie's change at the end of the story. There's a possibility that I involve him further, but I think it best if he doesn't participate in the actual adventure. Do you consider him important for any particular reason?

Great ideas, btw. "I'm lovin' it", to quote an infamous clown. :cool:

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[Aponi]

I don't mean that Robbie's brother ought to show up now and start doing stuff, no.

But what's the connection? Why would any ghost be able to transport someone living into an alternate reality? Robbie's not in "limbo" now, the land of dead people who don't realize they're dead, is he?

What I'm looking for is something to connect Robbie's brother to this world. Right now - you could have used any sort of plot device to get Robbie there. Why did you choose this one? When Alice fell down the rabbit hole, the rabbit kept showing up in the story, not as a "main character" but as something to follow. There's a good reason for that.

What's Robbie following?

[Bookwizard]

I think that were all hinting at the smae thing here and that we should leave D be for now so she has time to right the next chapter :lol:. But I think that Robbies brother should stay mysterious until maybe the end of the story, I envision him as more of that type of character. I really don't want to get ahead of myself but at the end Robbie could have traveled to a whole new world but only in his mind, and when he comes back at the end, thats when we will have his brother come back into the picture.

[D-Lotus]

Good points. Only bear in mind that I never said Robbie's brother truly existed. He could be a ghost, or a figment of the imagination, as the parents believe; it was meant to be ambiguous. Perhaps it was the boy's unconscious power of imagination that made the transportation- why do you think he came alone, and that his brother remained to 'haunt' the room? Could it be that Robbie created his brother's ghost in order to cope with the awesome power of his imagination, a power of creativeness which, if we think about it, has the ability to create separate realities? Was it perhaps because Robbie couldn't perceive the difference between his imagination and 'reality' that he embarked upon this journey?

These are questions the reader should deliberate and which the author should make more pronounced within the story.

In any case, I understand what you guys are attempting to communicate, and I hereby solemnly promise that Robbie will stop 'bouncing around' and find purpose in his adventure. :)

[D-Lotus]

Ok, I need direction for the new chapter. Last time you guys helped me a ton, so I thought I'd try this again.

You guys told me that the intro for chapter 7 was terrible; so, any good ideas as to how I should begin the new chapter?

Are the handcuffs a bad idea? Is it time for Robbie to shed them? How does Robbie demonstrate maturity?

Does the setting or environment seem overly oppressive, scarce, overwhelmingly detailistic? Should I expand the settings, leave as is, or delve into detail?

Lastly, anything else you guys want to add...

[Crunchyfrog]

On the subject of the handcuffs, I originally thought them to be sort of symbolic, but they're rapidly turning into little more than a fashion accessory.

The DP's of the earlier chapters seemed like puzzles and challenges, (escaping from the mind sucking chamber, the museum scene) which I really did enjoy. The handcuffs and his inability to communicate with his companion were major inhibitions to make the puzzles harder.

They're supposed to stop him from imagining stuff, but Smee is right, his thoughts and musings are really unaffected and that really does spoil the point of them.

In contrast, my main character in Magician's Touch who ends up in handcuffs by the end of the current chapter, can barely manage to retrieve an item from his own pocket with them on. They have so great an effect that he is not even able to make and act upon a decision, - and the most recent decision point has been passed to his companion.

Unless you can make the handcuffs 'matter' to the plot, I don't really see any reason for them, although once I start seeing flying donkeys and stuff I'll probably stop reading as I'm just not into that kind of stuff.

So in short - make them work to inhibit your character's successes in the story or lose them.

Hope that helps.

[Chinaren]

Quote: although once I start seeing flying donkeys

Probably best to cut back on the drinking too. ;)

Sorry D, :off:

[Traveller]

I think he needs to find a way to get those cuffs off...but I feel he needs to earn it...I don't want the resistance to just happen to have a key......perhaps the answer lies within the treasues at the church...personally I would have made removing the cuffs his actual test to prove himself to the resistance but I joined too late to suggest it...lol..

As for his brother, I have faith in you...I thought I saw a little clue in this last chapter that actually might have something to do with his brother (or I could be a delerious madman...)I won't devulge so as not to ruin the surprise if I am right.

As for the beginning of this chapter...what if he is already on his quest...in other words skip the exposition of him being told what his task is...let the readers discover it as he does it...

I would also like to echo the pleas for a mentor figure (I think the priest is the obvious one) and I would Like to see more of Jack

Keep it up...I look forward to actually being able to votr on this next chapter!!

[D-Lotus]

Quote: perhaps the answer lies within the treasues at the church...personally I would have made removing the cuffs his actual test to prove himself to the resistance but I joined too late to suggest it

Thanks, Traveller. Your insight has proved very valuable to me. You have given me an idea on how to respond to Crunchy's comment about the handcuffs:

Quote: make them work to inhibit your character's successes in the story or lose them.

Oh, and welcome to IF! :D