City of IF

[Ingrothechundyer]

Smee wrote: A request from me...

To be able to set the order of threads within a forum, as moderator of that forum.

It's annoying to make a string of announcements/stickies, and have them in a counter-intuitive order because they're ordered by 'last post date'. A work around is to post in them, or repost them in the order you want, last to first, but that only works if they are all locked from then on. As soon as someone posts in one, the order is screwed again.

As such, I would like to be able to numerically index the order I want them in, via the mod control view. This is 1, appears at the top, this is 2, this is 3 etc etc.

This wouldn't overwrite the order of Announcemts --> Stickies --> Normal, so you don't start getting Stickies above Announcements etc.

With no number entered, it defaults to the normal ordering by date.

Am I making sense?

Would be immensely useful for those with lengthy storygames, who want to keep their chapters in order, as just one example of it's value.

Just a thought.



This seems pretty straightforward.

I am assuming that topics that have not been assigned an order appear on the top of the list
I am assuming topics ordered 3, 2, 1 as in the image since if you are adding chapters you don't want to have to re-do all your numbering

Anything that helps authors who don't lock and sort their chapters get them in the correct order is a good thing IMO as it drives me nuts to try to catch up on a story and have to figure out where the next chapter is.
(No offense intended this is just the most recent one that drove me nuts;))

I don't really have much to add since Smee was so thorough... As usual all feedback on this mod is welcome :)

[Crunchyfrog]

I agree with that one. Its great for people to catch up with your story and great when they post on some of the chapters, but it ends up with those chapters getting out of order.

I'm absolutely behind this one! :D

[Thunderbird]

I don't like locking chapters so I'm 10000% behind this effort! (Any way to make it require a fable expense to access though? That'd be a nice way to drive some more fable value... without re-instilling a rent)

[Smee]

Great news Ingro :)

Your assumptions are quite correct, I hadn't considered that. Massively looking forward to this happening.

Happy Coding :)

[Ingrothechundyer]

Thunderbird wrote: (Any way to make it require a fable expense to access though? That'd be a nice way to drive some more fable value... without re-instilling a rent)

I see two ways this could be done.

1) Simple. Have an allow ordering checkbox on the form level and have the person purchasing it send the fables to the treasury and then the mayor turn it on.

2) Complex. Have a way for the user to directly purchase the ability to turn this feature on. I don't know how complex as I haven't examined the fable using code yet.

[Thunderbird]

I'm sure the easy route at first would give us some workability to adapt later too.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Easy route as in charge fables or easy route as in forget the whole fables thing?

[Thunderbird]

Well, I meant the 'simple' option above.

But I'd get it set up first without worrying about that anyhow unless its not much more to concern yourself with.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Probably ~10 minutes of work to put in the admin side. The work is basically done so it's C&P and then change some variables. If we are going to do it on the admin side we might as well do it now.

If we're going to charge fables for this feature regardless I might take some time to see how much work the charging side is and make a decision on what to do.

Are you thinking the purchase is for the life of the forum or is for a set time (like a month)?

~~~

After thinking about the UI side of charging fables for the forum I do have a concern:

For the most part we (the regular users) can work with the chapters being messed up. However it is a different situation when you are showing someone that is barely computer literate IF for the first time.

For someone that is barely comfortable with computers reading the chapters of a storygame from the bottom to the top is a challenge. (I have had one person give up because of this). Telling the user that they need to scan through the list for the next chapter (which could be anywhere) can be the difference between someone who will try and learn to work with the site and someone who will give up in frustration.

~~~

Of course the above could also be effectively addressed by requiring authors who don't purchase the privilege of sorting their threads to sort and lock as they go. ;)

My :2c:

[Emperor]

I agree with the fact that we should be able to reorder threads and whatnot as we wish. It is something that has bothered me as well. I do not agree however that we should be charged Fables to do so. I understand the need to make Fables have more value than they do and the only way to do so is to find some niche in which to spend them. I do not have the answer to how to achieve that, my issue is that it reminds me too much of the days in order to meaningfully participate in the site was to earn and spend Fables. I know that this subject is a debatable one, but in the end I do not think having to earn/spend Strata Gems, Fables, Legends or whatever else is a solution to posting and editing posts whether they be in a forum you mod in or not.

A side note that may or may not add to what has already been said. After my first introduction to the City and coauthoring a storygame I chose to leave the city for various reasons that were more personal in nature than anything that had to do with the City itself. After enough time had passed I considered returning to the City, this was when Fables were required to pay for running a SG. It was this and this alone that kept me from returning in a more full capacity. I realize that I'm a small fry around here and that my words to not carry much weight if any at all. I just thought it might surprise some of you that I waited intentionally until paying Fables to run SG's was over. And I know that I am not the only one to make this very same choice.

[HalfEmptyHero]

Emperor wrote: I agree with the fact that we should be able to reorder threads and whatnot as we wish. It is something that has bothered me as well. I do not agree however that we should be charged Fables to do so. I understand the need to make Fables have more value than they do and the only way to do so is to find some niche in which to spend them. I do not have the answer to how to achieve that, my issue is that it reminds me too much of the days in order to meaningfully participate in the site was to earn and spend Fables. I know that this subject is a debatable one, but in the end I do not think having to earn/spend Strata Gems, Fables, Legends or whatever else is a solution to posting and editing posts whether they be in a forum you mod in or not.

A side note that may or may not add to what has already been said. After my first introduction to the City and coauthoring a storygame I chose to leave the city for various reasons that were more personal in nature than anything that had to do with the City itself. After enough time had passed I considered returning to the City, this was when Fables were required to pay for running a SG. It was this and this alone that kept me from returning in a more full capacity. I realize that I'm a small fry around here and that my words to not carry much weight if any at all. I just thought it might surprise some of you that I waited intentionally until paying Fables to run SG's was over. And I know that I am not the only one to make this very same choice.

I agree with what emperor said. There is no reason to make everything cost fables, it takes away from the usability of the site.

[Thunderbird]

I was thinking something more than fair, like 100 f to unlock the ability for the author to use this added moderation tool in his own forum. By the time such a forum is earned, 100f is a paltry fee to pay for the capacity to make your story a bit more inviting. I'd think of it as a very minor advertising expense.

Again, I do understand above noted arguments however. And perhaps assigning a fee to such a useful tool (for the reader's sake) may seem a bit petty. Nevertheless, the concept we're up against with fables is finding what people WANT and making fables access it. As a Spotlight awarded author, there is no question this is something I'd want. But on the flip side, like the rent used to feel, I would think it could be perceived as a penalty for winning the Spotlight. So perhaps its not so much for the best.

I say go forward without charging and we'll continue to strive to find more uses for them elsewhere.

[Key]

I agree that we shouldn't charge for this. It seems odd to charge for something to help manage the site.

[Vishal Muralidharan]

Well... The idea is great, but I don't know about charging.

I wouldn't mind either way, but it does seem odd to charge a fee to help managing the site. I also get the feeling that we are a bit desperate to find a use for fables (which is a good thing, btw), but this shouldn't be charged.

This would mean that the winner of Spotlight would have to pay fables to be allowed a little bit of moderation within his/her forum. That doesn't sound nice to me.

That being said, 100 fables is a very low charge, and anyone would be willing to part with a 100 fables, provided that this is the only use of fables we have. I, personally, would part with more, because I have no idea what to do with the fables with me.

But either way, Fables or not, this idea is fantastic, and I'm totally with it.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Ok this is done and authors with there own forums can now set the display order of their topics at no charge.

[Smee]

And very cool it is too.

Perhaps not the most intuitive thing to work out, with the reverse order, but it does work better with the intention of adding further threads/chapters, and easy enough once you work out the logic.

Just tried it again on Trade Windows in the Stasis hall, and it does work brilliantly. It will likely need a guide though. My first attempt was lost because I didn't tick the box next to each one before pressing save.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Smee wrote: My first attempt was lost because I didn't tick the box next to each one before pressing save.

That's very odd. The check boxes don't have anything to do with the order updating. Are you sure you hit the "Save" button and not one of the other ones?

Each button does it's own thing :/

For example if you hit the "Lock" button it won't update the order no matter how many boxes you have checked as it is "Locking" them.

Do you think this should be changed so that every button updates the order as well as doing its thing?

[Smee]

I'm not sure no.

And yes, if that isn't a huge change, that'd probably help. So you can multi-task the mod actions.

[Ingrothechundyer]

It's not a huge deal but you do lose a confirmation when you are multi tasking.

I put the change up in the test folder if you can look at it and let me know what you think. Compare the 'Save' button to the 'Lock' button with all boxes unchecked.

[Smee]

Yep that works.

However, I have 1-11 set, the order is good. Removing say, number 3, and saving, doesn't take it out of the order... it just puts the 3 back in.

I'm not sure what I expected to happen when removing a number, but 'nothing' wasn't up there.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Smee wrote: However, I have 1-11 set, the order is good. Removing say, number 3, and saving, doesn't take it out of the order... it just puts the 3 back in.

I'm not sure what I expected to happen when removing a number, but 'nothing' wasn't up there.

Ok... The choices are 1) Nothing or 2) Remove the number.

I can have it do either. How many topics does this typically update? Since it has to query each topic on the page with #2 I want to make sure that we're aren't going to be running tons of updates.

[Smee]

You've lost me. But I think nothing is fine. I can't see any great need to remove a number once it's there.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Are you going to ever have a situation where you have 5000 or so topics in a single page on the MCP?

I've updated the test folder to set it back to nothing when you remove the number (or enter '0') if you want to look at it.

[Smee]

I wouldn't have thought so.

[Thunderbird]

This is absolutely fantastic Ingro! I just set up HM and it works like a charm. I used the checks before hitting save but apparently I didn't need to? Either way, cool. I do feel it orders backwards though. With every new chapter, we'll have to add a number to each entry again. Not a big deal though. Nothing compared to the awesomeness of simply having this function. Well done!

You've earned yourself a special title. Lemme know if it displeases you in any way and I should be proud to adjust it to suit your tastes instead.

[Ingrothechundyer]

Thunderbird wrote: I do feel it orders backwards though. With every new chapter, we'll have to add a number to each entry again.
You do the chapters in the order that makes sense to the reader :shock:

Most people do the first chapter on the bottom and then up so that's how I did the MOD.

If you're going to do it that way start with a number like 200 and work on down so you don't have to constantly redo your work :P

Thunderbird wrote: You've earned yourself a special title. Lemme know if it displeases you in any way and I should be proud to adjust it to suit your tastes instead.
Thank you :cool:

[Smee]

Yeah, just find the chapter you want to be at the bottom, put a 1 in it, and work your way up. :)